Dead By Daylight

[Karo]

I figured I'd just make it for the eventual times when it will get brought up anyways Dead By Daylight is an asymmetrical mutliplayer game from 2016 its currently been about 5 years since it released and they just released the resident evil DLC featuring Leon and Jill as survivors and Nemesis as a killer.

Survivors try to complete generator to power the exit gate and escape their death endlessly while the killers endlessly hunt them down and hook them and with the occasional offering to the spider monstrosities that all the characters are inside let them deliver the killing blow instead.

Most users have a very love & hate relationship with this game and its currently avaiable on steam, windows store, xbox, ps4/5, stadia, switch and your mobile devices. For the record the game does feature crossplay for the PC and consoles. The phone is done by a different eam altogether so its stand alone from the other versions. Cross progression is always in the talks for the console and PC version and yet to have reached any meaningful conclsuions.

And finally here a list of all the chapters that have came out for DBD:
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Chapters

DBD is the smash brothers of asymmetrical horror basically.

[Moonface]

I think this might be one of the few asymmetrical multiplayer games that managed to last back from when they were commonly released. I will be honest though, until that recent Resident Evil announcement, I truly believed this game was just running on fumes with a very niche community but I guess that isn't the case if they're securing notably big IP's for crossovers.

[Karo]

I mean it is definitely a niche but they are the queen of the niche. They have major horror franchises and two video game franchises under it belt. There are games that try to break into the market and who knows maybe some of them have the endurance to cope with DBD.

Honestly Friday the 13th game probably wouldn't be new content dead if Jason didn't go into license hell. There are plenty of games that try to pull off this formula, but they aren't as successful as DBD. THe newest one Home Sweet Home has potential to stay, but its also a lootbox type game so I'm avoiding getting into that one.

[Moonface]

Yeah, Friday the 13th looked pretty good for the few videos I watched of people playing it, and it sucks that it died due to licensing. I'm surprised the developers didn't attempt to just reskin it to remove any direct references to the license but I guess there were other things impeding that happening or it just wasn't going to be worth the trouble.

Not heard of Home Sweet Home: Survive (making the distinction because I got confused by the game that exists without that subtitle) before now, but I did see it's Early Access so there wouldn't be much marketing or talk about it yet unless you're into the asymmetrical genre already.

[Karo]

Moony don't give into Home Sweet Home: Survive you want to buy Dead by Daylight the new hit game by BHVR Entertainment. You can play as Jill Valentine and Leon S. Kennedy! Your two favorite characters from the hit game Resident Evil by Capcom!

[Moonface]

I have no intention on looking further into HSH:S except to see what it does different to DBD to make itself stand out. I don't touch MP only games until they've become established enough that finding matches isn't a slog.

I saw a video about the Resi characters where something happened with a feature called "sets" that impacted them, most notably in relation to their hair. I don't get how that system works though to understand properly what was wrong with them being put into sets.

[Karo]

Finding a match isn't a slog in DBD survivors are quickest in the morning and in the night time killers are quicker generally from what I noticed.

So sets were introduced last year with the release of Silent Hill now before that there was no setrs and you could mix and match as you choose, but the idea is sets are legendary skin that make a character into a different character, but there some outfits that are sets for cosmetic reasons, but there are a lot of them that really have no reason to be a set. For example most of the heads could easily be mixed and matched you'd just need to lock the top and bottom.

THe outrage with the Resident Evil set is at first the alternate outfit for Jill & Leon weren't a set, but after a hotfix where the Resident Evil map was causing people to crash it was turned into a set and people weren't buying the jill head because it was legit the same exact head model and the Leon head is slightly different, so people end up buying small pieces of it and this fucked everything up. So there are two ideas
1. Either Capcom had these in the contract that their characters were to be sold only in sets and they fucked up
2. BHVR being greedy and making us buy the same exact head piece.

Also usually ther are glitched discovered that allows you to glitch these sets anyways I'm not sure if they are currently still working and I hope BHVR doesn't patch them, but eh.

[Dragon Lord]

HSH would have a better chance if the developers weren't so terrible. Not that DBD has much better of a Dev team, but DBD was here first so it's going to have the advantage over HSH.

As for DBD, never played it myself, but used to watch Bahroo play it a lot. He's recently gotten back into it after taking a break for a good year or so, but I haven't been watching him play it this time around. Game just got too boring after a while. As for playing it, DBD has one of the absolute worst communities you'll find in gaming, rivaling toxicity levels of League of Legends, so I've never had much interest in it. The game doesn't bring out the best in people. You know it's bad when multiple streamers leave the game because they noticed what kind of a person the game was turning them into.

Also Moon, it could be the other way with them locking in big IP collabs like Resident Evil. They could be doing it because they have to do it in order to keep what players remain in the game interested. Nothing brings back a chunk of the player base like a Killer from a popular IP.

[Karo]

Home Sweet Home is a pretty interesting one, but I do think the freeze tag formula is more fun and when I tried killer in HSH I honestly wasn't a big fan of it you feel so slow and clunky compared to DBD plus the fact that the survivors can use a bunch of items against you and stun you and eventually frickin kill you is just wow. XD

Though I haven't really looked much into the HSH dev team and BHVR honestly has a bit of an angry fanbase I feel like they make some questionable decisions, and they really should use some of their time and money for a quality of life chapter for the game really iron out all those bugs that are here which I know is tough cause they break, but they really could use it especially if their art team is constantly releasing new cosmetics I don't think they really should be that concerned about their revenue unless the chapter release really is their biggest revenue.

As for the player base retention people speculate that there a constant flow of people coming and going, but I'm not really sure how true that is I looked at the steam chart and basically since it release it generally has maintained a player base of 20k+ people in it right now with the RE release it has gotten it biggest boost at 94k.

https://steamcharts.com/app/381210#All

Now will they maintain such a high player base? I'm not sure but generally it will probably stay over 20k if the previous statistic has shown us.

PS: Overall I feel like the DBD community can be pretty toxic in general as this is a game you both love and hate.

[Moonface]

So sets were introduced last year with the release of Silent Hill now before that there was no setrs and you could mix and match as you choose, but the idea is sets are legendary skin that make a character into a different character, but there some outfits that are sets for cosmetic reasons, but there are a lot of them that really have no reason to be a set. For example most of the heads could easily be mixed and matched you'd just need to lock the top and bottom.

THe outrage with the Resident Evil set is at first the alternate outfit for Jill & Leon weren't a set, but after a hotfix where the Resident Evil map was causing people to crash it was turned into a set and people weren't buying the jill head because it was legit the same exact head model and the Leon head is slightly different, so people end up buying small pieces of it and this fucked everything up. So there are two ideas
1. Either Capcom had these in the contract that their characters were to be sold only in sets and they fucked up
2. BHVR being greedy and making us buy the same exact head piece.

It would be an incredible level of incompetence for the outfits to be intended as sets as part of a contractual agreement and it not being done correctly right from the launch. How long was it between the Resi characters being released and the outfits being changed into sets?

As for DBD, never played it myself, but used to watch Bahroo play it a lot. He's recently gotten back into it after taking a break for a good year or so, but I haven't been watching him play it this time around. Game just got too boring after a while. As for playing it, DBD has one of the absolute worst communities you'll find in gaming, rivaling toxicity levels of League of Legends, so I've never had much interest in it. The game doesn't bring out the best in people. You know it's bad when multiple streamers leave the game because they noticed what kind of a person the game was turning them into.

Also Moon, it could be the other way with them locking in big IP collabs like Resident Evil. They could be doing it because they have to do it in order to keep what players remain in the game interested. Nothing brings back a chunk of the player base like a Killer from a popular IP.

It doesn't surprise me to hear DBD can be toxic, and I imagine a lot of it would come from a killer targeting a particular player or someone just perceiving themselves to be targeted "unfairly" and thus getting upset.

True about the IP thing. Can't really fault them though if that's the tactic, considering most games do collaborations for the sole purpose of drawing people in. I doubt there are many if any games that did a collaboration that wasn't primarily for boosting interest in the game.

Home Sweet Home is a pretty interesting one, but I do think the freeze tag formula is more fun and when I tried killer in HSH I honestly wasn't a big fan of it you feel so slow and clunky compared to DBD plus the fact that the survivors can use a bunch of items against you and stun you and eventually frickin kill you is just wow. XD

Stunning isn't really a negative since it can be done in DBD too to a degree with the barricades. However, being able to kill the hunter sounds like a recipe for problems, especially if a team can co-ordinate themselves in a way to keep the hunter stun locked, if stun locking is a thing in HSH.

[Maniakkid25]

Well, in fairness, you can do that sort of temporarily in Last Year (or at least make him go away) IIRC, so it's not an impossible mechanic to work with.

Yeah, the game is GunZ the Duel level of toxic. I actually rage quit Killer after being mocked for being bad at it when it was MY SECOND TIME EVER! I've been talking about getting back into Killer, but seriously screw these people.

The Hotfix came literally HOURS after the chapter was released. It's seriously that ridiculous.

[Karo]

I feel like in last year it works cause the killer is omnipresent in HSH you either have to be playing the killer that can teleport, but you can still only chase one survivor at a time. Plus the other survivors are constantly opening and dropping items on the floor so the survivor your chasing is getting resupplied with items as they go and they can stun you briefly. The killer can't be killed until a certain point, but once that point is release instaead of finishing the survivors will come and kill you and...well I didn't find it to be that fun. (Now of course just cause I didn't find it very fun doesn't mean it not fun for others just talking about my opinion )

BHVR is now offering refunds if you bought pieces of it by contacting customer support.

[Moonface]

Yeah, the game is GunZ the Duel level of toxic. I actually rage quit Killer after being mocked for being bad at it when it was MY SECOND TIME EVER! I've been talking about getting back into Killer, but seriously screw these people.

The Hotfix came literally HOURS after the chapter was released. It's seriously that ridiculous.

Ugh, reminds me of my time in CS:GO when I was still learning. The game makes you spend time in casual matchmaking until you reach something like Level 10, by which point you can enter ranked matchmaking. Problem is, the playstyle in ranked is far different to casual, and so you won't actually know any of the proper techniques of the game and so you end up getting kicked most of the time until you learn the mechanics in casual and come back and don't look instantly brain dead to everyone else.

I guess it being only hours after could mean they did mess up, but regardless of reason it doesn't sound like the developer did a good job of addressing the matter in a player satisfactory way.

I feel like in last year it works cause the killer is omnipresent in HSH you either have to be playing the killer that can teleport, but you can still only chase one survivor at a time. Plus the other survivors are constantly opening and dropping items on the floor so the survivor your chasing is getting resupplied with items as they go and they can stun you briefly. The killer can't be killed until a certain point, but once that point is release instaead of finishing the survivors will come and kill you and...well I didn't find it to be that fun. (Now of course just cause I didn't find it very fun doesn't mean it not fun for others just talking about my opinion )

It just sounds like a DBD x Evolve style game but in reverse for the format of the latter, where the villain starts off powerful but gets weaker as the game progresses. It would probably be okay if not for the poor balancing early game that makes it hard for the villain from the outset.

[Dragon Lord]

As for DBD, never played it myself, but used to watch Bahroo play it a lot. He's recently gotten back into it after taking a break for a good year or so, but I haven't been watching him play it this time around. Game just got too boring after a while. As for playing it, DBD has one of the absolute worst communities you'll find in gaming, rivaling toxicity levels of League of Legends, so I've never had much interest in it. The game doesn't bring out the best in people. You know it's bad when multiple streamers leave the game because they noticed what kind of a person the game was turning them into.

Also Moon, it could be the other way with them locking in big IP collabs like Resident Evil. They could be doing it because they have to do it in order to keep what players remain in the game interested. Nothing brings back a chunk of the player base like a Killer from a popular IP.

It doesn't surprise me to hear DBD can be toxic, and I imagine a lot of it would come from a killer targeting a particular player or someone just perceiving themselves to be targeted "unfairly" and thus getting upset.

Sadly it's mainly the other way around. Yes, there are toxic killers in DBD that will "tunnel vision" a survivor, or camp them, but most of the time those are signs of a bad killer, not a toxic one. By hyper-focusing on one survivor, you're letting the others do whatever they want, and 9 times out of 10 that's going to lead to a three or four escape loss. 

There are way more toxic survivors in DBD though. Mainly because the devs are very Survivor-biased, and they have given Survivors many very overpowered perks to escape the killer, while they usually nerf any of the overpowered Killer perks. Now, I do believe that in the last year or two they have started to nerf some of the more problematic survivor perks, but last time I checked in on the game, Survivors still have pretty huge advantages over the killers.

At least the devs got smart after a year or two when the game first came out and fixed all of the infinite loops. I remember the first year the game released, I watched Bahroo (playing Killer) get held hostage in a match for 3+ hours by a Survivor abusing an infinite loop ('loop' referring to a stretch of an area where a killer wouldn't be able to catch up to the survivor no matter what, allowing the survivor to continuously run a loop in that area). Over three hours of this little shithead just running. Granted Bahroo could have left the match at any time, but he was too stubborn to let the little troll get the best of him. Funny enough, in the end when the survivor finally got tired of his little game, he tried to jump into the escape hatch, only for Bahroo to grab him at the last second and get the kill on him.

So thankfully the toxicity of infinite looping is out of the game now, but there's still tons of ways that survivors are toxic little shits in the game, and yeah, if you're a relatively new killer, prepare to be told how much you suck every game because of it. Especially if veteran players are still intentionally keeping themselves at ranks 15-20 for quicker matches. Nothing says "Welcome to Dead By Daylight!" like having a Survivor with 1,000+ hours in the game staying at rank 20 to greet you as a brand new killer.

[Karo]

The game has recently nerfed survivor perks such as decisive strike so survivors are weaker then they were. It now disables if you get unhooked and take an action making it much weaker then it was so no more free 1 minute of doing whatever you want.

I cant honestly say if the dev's are majority biased in one side or another and probably depends on what their favorite role is and who has the majority but they did nerf Billy who most people said was balanced by giving him a cool down.

With the toxicity thing you are far more likely to get a tilted survivor than killer because 4 people against 1 then you gotta take into account the killer might not be able to play nice and has to focus down one survivor out of the game to snowball to victory.

To explain why killers cant play nice if all survivors are spread out in like two minutes in the best case scenario two-three gens could pop as you are hooking your first survivor for killers it's all about knowing how to apply pressure and getting that snowball before they complete all gens and it can be a nerve wrecking experience.